Healthy Living by Willow Creek Springs
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Healthy Living by Willow Creek Springs
Planning For Care Without Panic with Raymond Lavine
Most people plan to “figure it out later,” until later arrives with a hospital bracelet and a stack of bills. We invited Raymond Lavine—financial services veteran, caregiver advocate, and host of Planning with Purpose—to help us design long-term care with intention instead of panic. The result is a candid, deeply practical conversation about how to choose where and how you’re cared for, what it costs, and how to set up your family to act without confusion.
We start by reframing the problem: long-term care is not just an end-of-life issue. It can be triggered by accidents, stroke, cancer, cognitive decline, or simple frailty at any age. Raymond outlines a three-part framework—vision, timing, and funding. Vision means deciding whether you prefer care at home or in a facility and how you want decisions made if you can’t make them yourself. Timing means starting before health issues limit options, since underwriting and premiums hinge on current health. Funding explores self-funding versus long-term care insurance and hybrid policies, with plain talk about taxes, liquidity, and how to balance premium costs with meaningful benefits.
We also unpack the confusion around Medicare Advantage versus Medigap, why so many people get conflicting answers, and how to find the right expert who will translate trade-offs into clear choices. Then we move into organization: communicating your wishes to family, setting powers of attorney and health directives, and keeping critical documents accessible both on paper and digitally. Raymond shares simple, repeatable habits—using calculators to estimate longevity and cost of care, logging medical visits and medications, and reviewing plans after major life events—that protect dignity and reduce chaos when stress is high.
If you want a plan that preserves independence and spares your family from guesswork, this conversation outlines the steps to get started today. Listen now, share it with someone you love, and tell us one action you’ll take this week. If the show helps, subscribe, leave a review, and pass it along to a friend who needs a nudge.
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Well, hello, and welcome back to the Healthy Living Podcast. I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, and today we've got a very special guest. His name is Raymond Levine. And uh Raymond is an interesting guest because he has experience that goes into all sorts of facets. And we're going to be talking about um caregiving, possibly insurance, um, all sorts of health-related topics. And he's also a co-author of Empathy and Understanding in Business and the host of Planning with Purpose, the Caregivers Blueprint. Raymond, welcome to the show. I know we've been going back and forth for a little bit. Um, it's great to have you. I'm looking forward to hearing about your story.
SPEAKER_01:Well, thank you for having me on your program. I'm honored to be here.
SPEAKER_00:So I I always like to start a conversation um to see how did our guests find their way here? And then in your in your example, how did you find your way to the work that you're doing right now? Was this your life dream as a child, or is this something you stumbled into? Or tell us about how you got where you are.
SPEAKER_01:Well, most of my background has been in financial services. I've uh been with uh um um City National Bank, and uh um and I've also been with uh um insurance companies, Mutual New York and uh New England Life. It's now part of uh it's Canadian company. I can't think of the name now, but uh well I I know it's owned by MetLife. Um and uh I've also uh um founded uh and ran for a while a uh mortgage banking. Um and I've also been uh in uh um in property management. And so it's mostly you know financial services. But uh the way I got into uh um long-term care benefits uh was um it you know it was it was gradual. Uh but eventually uh when we needed a long-term care plan, um I uh I you know and I heard the fellow that uh sold us our plans. I like the business. I like the I I like the idea. So um, and also uh when I say gradual, also um my mother at the time uh I got in the business was all was was in long-term care. Um, and uh my wife's parents uh were also uh uh at the point where they needed long-term care. So uh, you know, with that, with with that, uh my wife and I talked about saying, you know, look, we need we need to get a care care plan uh when we need caregiving. So that's a long answer to your short question.
SPEAKER_00:I like that. Um, you know, it's a thing we talk about here fairly regularly and and with a lot of different points of view, you know, with special needs and all sorts of different things. But at the end of the day, as we get older, you know, the old school way of doing it was you move back in with your kids and they take care of you. But that doesn't always work out so well. Maybe it will, maybe it will usually it's the other way now.
SPEAKER_01:It's a lot of kids that are that are living with the parents, or you know, uh, we're living in a different culture, uh culture or um um lifestyle. Maybe rather than saying culture, I'll say lifestyle. There are a lot of grandparents that are taking care of their grandchildren.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it's it's completely kind of opposite, and I I don't know that I like it. You know, the the the the youngsters have all the energy and uh the wherewithal, they're the ones supposed to be carrying the load. Um, but that's that's a whole nother conversation. When you're dealing with insurance, but it is part of aging.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, uh and and and lifestyle of what oftentimes the plan, you know, the plan you have doesn't always meet reality. And what I mean by that is that you think, you know, uh uh uh we have a family and then uh and then they leave and we're empty nesters, then we do this or that, and then we find out you know, things happen. Uh uh uh it could be because of economics, job, it could be because of health issues, um, it could be uh uh mental health. There could be a lot of reasons why the plan changes, not because you uh planned it, it just happens where the uh either the children return to home home for very various economic reasons or social or or the uh people uh people's kids because for what for various reasons the um parents cannot take care of the grandchildren. So uh the only thing I could say is that you if if you do if you're a grandparent and uh uh you're taking care of kids, you better find some enthusiasm somewhere.
SPEAKER_00:There you go. Hey, you know, on some level, maybe it helps keep you young. I keeping active and keeping uh keeping enthusiastic is definitely um part of the longevity code. So I I there could be some wisdom and all that. So coming out of the insurance game, you know, insurance is is a pretty complicated um conversation these days. And um, you know, there's life. Well, you see, it's complicated.
SPEAKER_01:What do you mean by complicated? Because when I when I explain it to people, I try to uncomplicate. So tell me what go ahead.
SPEAKER_00:Complicated in I have a problem, I need insurance, I need to find an answer that's affordable and gives me what I need, and then I have to go and solve that problem. And so, like with health insurance right now, it's it's a very difficult problem to solve. I'm dealing with that right now. My health insurance just went up by a factor of five um recently. Um, and I'm overcoming cancer right now, so I can't switch coverage because I don't know if a new coverage, new company would even cover what I'm dealing with right now. So that's a complication. I don't know much about life insurance, I've never had it, and I don't really know what it offers except for to the people that are in your wake after you pass. Um, I'm a legacy guy, so I'm building something that'll survive me and and um everything will go go to that. But um, I'd like to understand, you know, um the the I guess the appeal or the need, the necessity of things like that. Um that's where the complication would come for me is just going, well, you know, why is it that I would need that? Or number one, I need this, how do I get it in a way that makes any kind of sense?
SPEAKER_01:Well, one of the things that you know I've said to myself and and and and and in my life and career is that um when you're in high school, um, you know, you take, you know, uh uh the courses, and depending on you know whether you're uh college bound or technical bound or prison bound or whatever bound you you're you're in, sure. That um, you know, they'll teach you sex education, sort of, they'll teach you technical courses, you know, uh, but there are no courses that I'm aware that I ever took about uh finance or you know how to how to buy insurance, uh how do you how to how to apply for a credit card, how how to do all the uh how to write read.
SPEAKER_00:They should have that in in grade school. You know, you get into the time when you need it, nobody knows what they're doing.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And of course it's changed, you know, in uh uh in my lifetime where there are a lot of you know uh young people that don't know how to write a check because everything and and so they know they they they and they understand that. In fact, uh I was changing accounts and I said, I need you know, check uh I need checks. They said, Why do you need checks? And so I think uh yeah, and this is to this is this is to a bank representative. That that I thought was the uh uh that was an i that was an interesting because I must say that I was it stalled me for a moment.
SPEAKER_00:So yeah, yeah, yeah. Wait a minute. We always oh yeah, you don't really write checks the way you used to. I mean, I I still have companies that I write checks to, but not a lot, not not nearly like it was.
SPEAKER_01:Well, that's that's true and it's it's efficient, but uh uh but you look, uh, you know, when you drive a car now, sometimes you have a spare tire, sometimes you don't. So it's but I I like the idea of a spare tire. The problem is that uh uh I'm too old and uh uh and and and uh uh I don't have the enthusiasm to uh change a tire, but you know, triple A. I mean, look, that's the you know, all that stuff has changed. I mean, I'm so old that I remember uh uh pre-call boxes, then I had then uh uh uh the advertising for call boxes. Now uh all you know uh um phone booths, telephone uh I agree.
SPEAKER_00:I'm right there with you.
SPEAKER_01:All go all all gone. So what does everybody, you know, what are we doing? We all we all have a cell phone, which has become the epitome of uh uh of uh of our culture. There it you'll never see a television program where somebody isn't talking on the phone, you know, use their cell phone for something.
SPEAKER_00:I couldn't agree more. Hey, let's let's jump into uh long-term care. I think that um I I knew we were gonna have a good conversation and and we could talk about anything more than likely. But you know, long-term care is a thing that we've talked about on this podcast numerous times with various different angles. Um, but the truth is at one point we're gonna all come to a point in our life where we're gonna want a little help. Um, why don't you tell me a little bit about your thoughts and and and you know what what what you offer with regards to long-term care?
SPEAKER_01:The way well, hold on. The way I talk about it is this uh I'll start off with hope is not a strategy. And when you're talking about, you know, aging and fit uh uh uh and your and your and your lifespan, you gotta have a plan. You gotta have a vision. If you don't have a vision, you know, what are you what are you doing on this planet? And so um, you know, whatever, whatever, whatever your plan is, we know we've talked about this earlier, you know, there are going to be changes. There are going to be, you know, uh the plan you have uh isn't uh is isn't always going to be filled or you fulfilled or you're all or you're gonna have to have to change. But in your financial planning, in aging, you're along before aging, you could you there are certain things that will be helpful to your life. Uh it's helpful if you learn how to how to save money. It's helpful if you know how to have good credit. It's helpful if you know, you know, about financial planning. And you know, if you don't like reading books, take a you know, take take a community college course. There uh uh uh you can take it in person. You you know, now these days you can take it online. I mean, I'm so old you had to go, you have to uh attend a uh a class in in a f in a physical building. Right, right. But uh uh there are a lot of ways you can learn. Look, if and if you don't want to do that, look it up on YouTube. I mean, there's so there are so many courses and things. Uh I'll I'll give you a side story that's sort of it's not related, but it uh of YouTube. We were we rented a car and uh we couldn't figure out how to open up the gas cap. And and so uh we looked, you know, I I I I I put in the the model said, How do you how do you open this gas cap? And and the YouTube and the person said, you know, you may have this vehicle and you may not know. And so uh I figured out, you know, it it showed me how to open up the gas cap. There was some paper. Uh so that's what uh and I mean that's a true story. That was that that was uh in Texas a few months ago. But the point, but the point is that there are a variety of ways that you can learn things, and you just have to, you know, get in the habit. There's a book called Uh The Power of Habit by Charles Duhig. Very good book, very readable, that teaches, you know, and it teaches people how to get in the habit of uh doing things, you know, incrementally. But uh uh uh you know, planning your life, you gotta you gotta have a vision, you gotta have a plan. Or or uh, and if you and if you don't find one or borrow somebody's or steal, however you're gonna do it, you know, right, right.
SPEAKER_00:There's a lot of good templates out there.
SPEAKER_01:That's right. That's right. But the most important template is, and it it may sound political, uh, but you don't want to be poor in America. You really don't. You don't have the social services uh uh available as as we once do, or if you or if uh or it it's not it's not reliable. And there's so many you know aspects that I can talk about it because I think I think people uh f feel that uh uh they're entitled to something. And the answer I give is you may be entitled, but you're not eligible. I'll give you an example. I'm a veteran. And I may be eligible for veterans benefits, but I'm not entitled. And what do what do I mean by that? I mean that I'm eligible, but I'm only entitled if I qualify. It doesn't just do it because they said, hi, uh Rain Levine, you know, United States Army, sergeant, you know, uh uh uh uh honorable discharge. I'm entitled. No, you're not. No, I'm not. I'm I'm eligible, maybe, uh based on uh um certain criteria. Uh and and most of it comes down, oh, I'm shocked to say this. It comes down to about your finances. You know, what assets do you have? Do you have a home? Do you have uh uh retirement plans? Do you have other uh other assets that may or may not make you eligible?
SPEAKER_00:So absolutely. I I think that's important. I think you know, things like as I'm you know, I turned 60 this year, so I'm getting trying to, I need to prepare myself to figure out Social Security and and and you know, Medicaid and all this other stuff that you know I will be potentially eligible for, but you have to go through and figure it out. You have to apply, you have to do those right things, or you're not gonna get it.
SPEAKER_01:Or or you know, or to add to that, if you don't know, and I'm you know, I I it may seem that you know when I talk about YouTube that I was being uh friv frivolous, uh I I I wasn't. I mean, I I use it. Here's something that you know will be shocking is that and uh uh Steve Jobs uh uh um I I uh re uh uh read um his story about it. If you don't know somebody, ask somebody. Right. Somebody that you know has uh uh uh knowledge. And you know, he has a story of you know uh they wants the parts, so he called up uh Bill Hew Hewlett, Hewlett Packard, and he spoke to him personally. He says, I need these parts. Right. So uh if you don't know something, ask somebody that has uh uh uh inf in information or you know, or pay somebody for the expertise. We do it all the time. If you go to the doctor, you think they're not working for free.
SPEAKER_00:Exactly.
SPEAKER_01:Of course, if you don't have insurance uh uh or uh you know or or the or the co-insurance, but the point is ask somebody that has uh uh information to help you in order to make informed decisions. So you know you were talking about Medicare. Um that uh uh before I uh qualified for Medicare, I I called uh a number of people and I was very frustrated. I couldn't find it, you know, I couldn't get the the kind of understanding about it uh that I wanted. Meaning every I thought, well, everybody's asking this question, they're getting an answer, and I'm asking it and I'm getting an opposite uh Right, right.
SPEAKER_00:I'm not saying it right.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, but what I what I wanted to know, what I wanted to understand was what's the difference between Medicare Advantage and what's a Medicare supplement. And finally I found somebody that told me the story, and then you know, uh would say, you know, here here are the plans. We did it all online, and I was in hog heaven. I thought, you know, you know, here's also another point is that it isn't just asking people, it's asking the right people that have the information that you should that you need to know.
SPEAKER_00:A hundred percent. So when you're talking about a long-term care plan, um, I'm sure you have kind of bullet points or an outline of of the the key factors, the key pillars. What what would you say all of, you know, if you have a good long-term care plan, what would that include?
SPEAKER_01:There are three questions that I ask people. The first is what's your vision about another way of saying, what do you want your care, what do you want your caregiving to do? This is also part of, you know, uh life planning. Um of uh and eventually, you know, there are there are either decisions that you will make or that will be made for you. And Americans do uh usually, you know, they'll say, I don't want, I don't want government, I don't want people to tell me what to do. I don't want my wife to tell me what to do or my spouse, I don't want people to tell me what to do. But if you're uh at a situation where you need, you know, that you will need caregiving, uh, you're not gonna be able, it's not a unlike you know, hobbies is of caregiving is not do it yourself. It really it isn't. It's just not do it yourself. So there are three things. One, what's your vision or what do you want your caregiving to uh to do? And what I mean by that is do you want it at home? Do you will you need a care center? Uh, how long do you think you might, you know, based on your family history, how long do you think you'll need it? Um, you know, do you have longevity in your family? And you know, this also thing of people just say, well, yeah, I'm 80, 85 and I'm in good health. Great, but at some point, you know, uh you may think you're in good health, you may think everything is fine, but the uh you actually may need more care because you're you know, because you're forgetful or driving. Things wear out, yeah. Exactly. Or even even even even look, Warren Buffett, uh uh um, you know, actually he he's even admitted he's slipping. And also, I, you know, seeing his movements, and he probably, you know, he needs a level of uh caregiving, even though he could say, um, look, you know, even if he's retired, but you know, frailty, and this is, you know, sometimes frailty is a process where you may be in fairly good shape, but you're frail, you're not able to do all the things. And that's part of, you know, what's your vision if you if you need care? The second is uh the sooner you have a caregiving plan or any kind of plan, do it, do it, do it now, do it soon, do uh have something in place, just like you have your uh um retirement planning and your estate planning, uh, and then incrementally, you know, take a look at it. Uh uh the other is your health assessment. You know, uh long-term care insurance uh in most situations is by health assessment. You got to be in some reasonable health, and there are various plans that may cover you, maybe not as long as you may want based on your health. I even can offer plans. You have no health, and you can still I can still get you a plan if you have some assets. But that that's an that's that's another podcast, that's another story. But there there are various ways that you can do it. Now, I'll I I'm not gonna uh it's it's uh whatever plan, whatever. caregiving plan you have if you want to if you want to self-fund or what they call self-insure but that's really you're not self-insured you're self-funding right and and if you and if you want to use your assets and you're uh happy with pa pay uh paying for it with after tax then that's what you know that's what you're going to do or your financial planner says look you know you make enough money you can do both lifestyle and your caregiving you can't you you you won't you won't I mean unless you're worth hundreds of millions of dollars it's just not it's not practical and even if even if you do even if you do then it's still a better investment because it's tax free and you meet and this we're in tax season you're gonna you're gonna tell me the people going you're talking to their tax repairs say hey I want to pay as much taxes as I can you know I want I I want my you know state state uh uh uh local state and federal I want them to have as much money so they can fill up all the potholes and do all the things I want I I I want to do which actually I'm I'm I'm I I'm I'm pro uh filling up potholes I've i I will tell I will t I will tell you my political position I I I I like good streets um but uh and and and uh the third is when the sooner you have a care plan whether you own a uh an actual long-term care plan or you don't is that it's it uh the older you are the more the the more the higher the premiums why it's real obvious right near you're nearer to caregiving however you never know I mean you know uh you're 60 you uh you you say you've had cancer that's that's a long way uh and and you may live another 20 years uh I'm gonna live longer than that if if if if all goes well uh um I live another 50 years yeah well good luck on that but you'll see but the uh the point is that you know things can happen to you at different times because uh caregiving isn't just old you know people always think you know when when they see us old people you know wanting around that's that's the time to think about it the best time to think about it is is in your you know beginning maybe in your 30s or 40s why because uh it isn't it isn't just old age and frailty uh a lot of things happen to people cancer strokes heart attacks uh uh neurological cognitive car accidents uh illness you know all kind all kinds of things that happen to people at uh all uh all different ages and you know personal you know my father uh my parents were both lawyers my mother was an estate planning attorney and uh the reason I say and my father uh eventually became a judge but three times in his life in in his young life when he uh starting in his 40s and 50s he he had a uh a major automobile accident he broke uh he broke his back and he was out for uh I don't know uh eight months second time he thre he fell off a horse he broke his his uh hip and his his arm he was out for a year and a half and then the third time was it was the big one it was the heart attack that uh uh uh but it took three years to uh before he died it was full full time and then my mother and my parents were not insurance buyers you know you're talking about you know you know about life insurance my my parents uh would own uh insurance that they needed to own business and personal but they weren't into you know in essay buying life insurance certainly not long-term care benefits until the third time where you know they got the plot you know this caregiving uh uh is it you know it's time uh you know even people say it's noble it's time consuming and there are a lot there are a lot of things to do we were talking about you know uh cultural shifts where um when you're caring for somebody it's the same in some ways it's similar to caring for a child the difference is when you're caring for an adult you're caring for an adult and they have rights and privileges and they uh are uh can be more more verbal also uh you can't when if they get become annoying you can't just pick them up and you know put them in the crib or put in a closet or something uh uh uh you know the they'll they'll they'll call that elder the term is uh elder abuse I'm told there you go uh I mean uh yeah I know you know it's child abuse but it's not funny and uh because uh you know especially in uh well uh at care facilities you know there are issues about uh uh care abuse but there there also is home care care abuse and also you know it could be a f uh financial issue meaning that if you have somebody caring for for you it isn't just you know um uh making you porridge and a sandwich or get you uh bathing and dressing it's other things uh it's um uh financial you know you may have to have somebody taking care of your finances well I would like somebody that's honest and not stealing my money uh so you know you gotta you you gotta be careful about that the other thing is you got to let your family know you know what you where uh you want your caregiving so that they know don't keep it don't keep it a state secret you know let let them know also let them know where your um financial documents are and if you're not organized get organized uh two ways one manually have it in folders and have in a file and tell you know some people that you trust or your family where where where it is the worst thing is uh to say I don't know my social security number I don't know the pat I can't tell you the passwords um my my uh uh healthcare documents you know have all have the important documents uh in place and also have a digital the other thing if uh uh uh if you do it and I uh I I learned how to do it and I had a major heart attack uh uh uh over 10 years ago and so uh I I uh I I use Evernote so I have notebooks for every time that I go any kind of medical interaction uh I put it in uh the digital notebook and then I'll scan it you know whatever it is because if you say you know when was your last vaccine even if it was five days ago I don't know I got a I got a vaccine is I can look it up you know on such and such yes I got a flu shot or I got a COVID. Actually that I can't remember because uh because it's only been a couple of weeks but uh uh you know that's the way I organize myself because it scared me that I thought hey I'm in this business and I'm advising people and I'm uh and my and my shoes have whole holes in them maybe maybe if I'm going to advise people I should take my own advice.
SPEAKER_00:Agreed agreed well you know Raymond this has been fascinating um I would like to see if you had a minute or two to share a central thought or something that wraps all this up into a a package or or a little what they call an elevator pitch for our listeners what would that look like?
SPEAKER_01:Well um go to my website www.lavis and victorientcin s dot com leineltcin s dot com and there are a couple of things that uh you can do if you look in the upper left corner of the website uh you can put in uh uh your information uh about your lifestyle and be honest you know be honest about your lifestyle and it will let you know you know uh your possible long longevity based on based on your lifestyle the and then it will show you uh if you needed caregiving depending on how uh how how many years what it would cost um so it'll give you sort of you know it'll give you a reality check but it also uh hopefully it will say look you know based on this uh maybe I uh uh if I haven't if I don't have a caregiving plan uh and I don't have my estate plan perhaps perhaps I should get my affairs in order and the other is that on most websites you go to uh um it'll have frequently asked questions okay and I'm I've never been a fan of of frequently asked questions because it usually never answers what I what I want to know so I have a uh an AI generated where you can ask ask questions you know who you I mean you can even be as who is Raymond Levine but you can but you can ask questions about you know uh what is I'll give you the the main question everybody out how much does long-term care insurance cost of course the the answer to that is it based on your age your premium what you want to accomplish but it but it'll it'll it'll it'll it will give you an answer so you don't have to look through the the frequently asked questions you could you can uh you can you can write it in and it will and it and it will give you a good answer.
SPEAKER_00:Oh nice excellent all right Raymond well this has been an absolute pleasure I thank you for uh joining the show is there any other contacts um that you want to share with our listeners so that they can find you uh well they can find me three ways one of the search engines put in Raymond Levine you can find me on LinkedIn you can find me on Facebook uh I don't use Reddit and uh uh uh TikTok so uh if you look for me there you won't find me but it but search engines LinkedIn Facebook beautiful beautiful well thank you so much Raymond and uh I'm looking forward to uh exploring a little bit of this myself and you know I always like to welcome our guests back as we opened up a lot of doors there's probably a lot more we could talk about with regards to maybe some of the specifics about insurance and and you know how some of these things work or what you know what it what they look like. But I definitely want to open the door to come back and continue conversation and just want to thank you for joining us today.
SPEAKER_01:It will be my pleasure it's been my pleasure to be on your podcast today. It'll be my pleasure if you invite me in the in the future I will I will attend as they say.
SPEAKER_00:Beautiful beautiful well this has been another episode of the Healthy Living Podcast. I'm your host Joe Grumbon and I want to thank our listeners that have made this show possible and we will see you next time.
