Healthy Living by Willow Creek Springs
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Chihiro Hozumi and Dr Robert Hoffman Join the Healthy Living Podcast
What happens when you weaken a tumor’s favorite fuel and time chemotherapy to hit at its most vulnerable moment? We sit down at the Anti-Cancer Institute with Dr. Robert Hoffman and Chihiro Hozumi to unpack a practical, evidence-backed model combining a low-methionine diet, methioninase, and standard chemo for aggressive, recurrent breast cancer. Chihiro’s story begins with invasive lobular carcinoma—hard to detect, quick to spread—and a recurrence so deep and wide that surgery seemed off the table. Her turnaround came from aligning treatment with biology: strict methionine restriction, enzymatic depletion using methioninase, and a carefully chosen chemo plan that delivered roughly 95% tumor reduction in three months.
We explore why methionine addiction is a real metabolic choke point in many cancers, how reducing this essential amino acid can make tumors less resilient, and why adding methioninase compounds the effect. Dr. Hoffman explains the science and the standards he expects: published data, mechanisms, and reproducibility. Chihiro shares the human side—the early missteps with protein-rich foods, the fear while waiting for chemo to start, and the discipline that followed. After response, the plan didn’t stop: she stayed on a low-methionine diet, continued methioninase, and moved to maintenance with a targeted cell-cycle inhibitor and close PET surveillance.
Access and culture matter too. Japan now leads in integrating methionine restriction into oncology practice, with supportive clinicians, advanced imaging like Met-PET, and a growing patient cohort. That ecosystem, paired with rigorous documentation, points to a repeatable paradigm: starve the tumor’s metabolic crutch, strike with chemo for maximum synergy, and maintain pressure to keep recurrence at bay. It’s not a silver bullet; it’s a disciplined, data-driven strategy that patients can actually follow.
If this conversation helps you rethink your plan—or offers hope where options feel thin—share it with someone who needs it. Subscribe for more evidence-based stories, leave a review to help others find us, and tell us: what’s the one change you’re ready to make today?
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Okay. Well, hello, and welcome back to the Healthy Living Podcast. I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, and I have with me a couple of very special guests. And I'm actually recording this from the Anti-Cancer Institute in San Diego with Dr. Robert Hoffman and Shihiro Azumi. All right, I get your last name right. Wonderful. Shahiro's in from Japan. Um, I just got back from another appointment with Dr. Song, and I thought, wow, this is a perfect uh uh opportunity to sit and have a conversation. And Shahiro, I really want to talk to you a bit because you know you are a big part of all of this. And you know, when we have our Sunday calls, uh, you know, you're the one coordinating this all the way from Japan.
SPEAKER_03:Right, right.
SPEAKER_01:And so we got big time zone differences, language issues, we got all these things, and yet we we make this beautiful call happen. And you're one of the key uh elements of this group and your story. Um, you're overcoming cancer, using the low methionine diet, methionine is um, and and and going from you being told you had to have radical surgery to you don't have a tumor anymore.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_01:Um what a beautiful story, and uh it really helps those of us who are trying to get a word out and and and share with people when we have multiple points of view, multiple stories, multiple experiences, but certain things in common that really makes this a powerful message. And then, of course, we got Robert Hoffman here who you know is instrumental in uh not only the discovery of cancer's addiction to methionine, um, and and and creating methionine A's, making it available to people who need it, starting the anti-cancer institute and and and working relentlessly for you know most of your life on this work. It's like, and we're all sitting here together in the same room. I just am excited. Robert, how are you doing today?
SPEAKER_02:I'm doing I'm doing good, Joe. Um happy to have this discussion.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, me too. It's um, you know, we we it's funny because sometimes I I go back and I listen to episodes and I think it sounds like I'm kind of repeating myself. But you know, each time we delve into another little slice of this, another nuance, another angle. And you're right, it's a drum beat. Like it's a drum beat. The thing is, like, if you don't repeat yourself in the world anymore, you just get passed right on by. But if you can repeat yourself in a way that is genuine, um heartfelt, uh uh emphatic, um accurate, you know, Robert, you hold us to a high standard, you know. It's like a lot of times people want to say things because they saw something or they felt something or they read something, and and we we we say things as though they're true because we think they're true or we want them to be true.
SPEAKER_03:Right, right.
SPEAKER_01:But Robert comes back and he goes, show me the evidence, right? Show me the paper. I want to see this, I want to see who found it, how did they find it, what were they looking for, who paid them? Um, you know, what how do they do their work? You know, let's let's evaluate this, not just I noticed a thing and there are this is what it was. And I think that's huge because I know a lot of doctors, even who are adamant about their work and they're they're passionate about these things they do, but you know, they're working off of anecdotal evidence like most of us, you know, when we're experiencing things, and then they make a statement as though maybe they have more evidence than they do, and then people go, Oh, I heard this from this guy, and so I believe it, and so I do it. And maybe they put themselves at a risk that is unwarranted, or maybe they don't do a thing that they should do because it is warranted. And uh Shahiro, I'd like to learn a little bit more about you. Um, you know, I you're on every meeting, um, you organize these things, you you I know your backstory. Why don't you share briefly with the listeners your backstory?
SPEAKER_00:Sure. Um uh my can I I'm a coun cancer patient. Right. And then uh I don't know which year, you know, I haven't 2018. I had a uh mastectomy of the uh left left uh breast because my cancer was detected by uh Japan health check, like an ERE health check. And then all of a sudden my uh result says you gotta go to see a breast surgeon. And then I went there and then, oh my god, you know, I have a cancer. Right. And I contacted the uh Dr. Hoffman. I I had a cancer.
SPEAKER_01:How did you know Dr. Hoffman?
SPEAKER_00:Uh before that, I have been helping him.
SPEAKER_01:Oh okay.
SPEAKER_00:Mm-hmm. Yes.
SPEAKER_01:So you guys had a had uh a work.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, already jobs.
SPEAKER_01:But I was fortunate for you.
SPEAKER_00:Right, right.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Then he has uh uh so many uh uh uh uh conference, like a cancer conference. He's been attending it. He has a lot of uh uh surgeon, doctor, council doctor. He knows so many high-rank you know doctors in Japan. He picked uh most uh great uh uh breast cancer uh doctor. Uh that's uh Japan uh cancer center, cancer main center.
SPEAKER_01:He's a connected guy.
SPEAKER_00:Right, and he's a chief called the breast surgeon. Okay, and uh when he saw that, okay, I gotta do your surgery. And uh uh when I uh uh in hospitalized only 10 days I got a surgery. Wow, and then that time my cancer type is ILC.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:Uh invasive lobular uh carcinoma. Okay, that doesn't make the uh lamp. Okay, it's like a gradual it's spread under the skin. Okay, so very difficult to detect. Yeah, so when my cancer is uh considerably considerably rare cancer, okay, uh among the breast cancer, and then that's why it's very uh difficult to detect because it doesn't make a right, it doesn't do what mine did come on this way, it just kind of spreads like a slime mold. Yeah, so slime mold. Yeah, that that's why I the doctor at the I mean Tsuki, I mean Japan cancer center at the main hospital says uh looks like that your diameter is a four centimeter, but after the surgery, they said diameter was eight centimeters. You know, cancer was spread it. So uh I took the micaseptomy, right? Then I didn't do the uh chemo after that.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:Uh I then I had a uh hormone broker for three years. And every year I went to a check, Yarry checked, mm-hmm and checked, and checked the 30 year.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Uh the my doctor's.
SPEAKER_01:They had markers that you were able to do. Right, right.
SPEAKER_00:And then marker was like a normal range and the MR uh C T contrast CT, no problem. You know, 30 year, he said, Oh, Miss Ozuni, congratulations, you have no cancer. Came back. Okay, right. But uh, you know, uh, I have some kind of uh irritation, my uh under the armhole.
SPEAKER_04:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:And then he said, Oh, yeah, let me let me take the uh some tissue out. Yeah, then the result came, oh sorry, you had uh cancer.
SPEAKER_01:Oh shit. Oh what a nightmare, right? You're good, you're good. Nope, you're not good.
SPEAKER_00:Then I was I was kind of shocked. Yeah, cried and called Dr. Hogman. Yeah, and then right there, you know, you gotta be matching restricted to diet. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then I uh started and then after that, I mean uh up eight uh 2018, I took uh uh all of my cancer out.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:So Dr. Hogman told me, being telling me, you gotta be restricted to Matron in food, Metronin food, don't eat the Metonian food. But I didn't, I never listened there. Right, most people don't know because I took it. Yeah, yeah. That's like, you know, Joe, unbelievable. I was so regret.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, of course.
SPEAKER_00:I eat the eggs, I was taking it and then eat.
SPEAKER_01:I eat sardines every day.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, then uh lunch, you know, like a hamburger, sushi, you know, like the Korean barbecue. Yeah, three years, normal food I ate. Then the result of that, uh my cancer was really deep and big and spread. And doctors said, I'm not able to do a surgery because too deep and too wide, otherwise I can't take all your meat out, tissue out. Yeah, so I have to do a chemo. Same chemo. Just like choke.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, just like choke. Actually, chemo, right? Yeah, then uh but shrink it down and then go after it. Yeah, yeah. That's what they were gonna do from me.
SPEAKER_00:That that that time I was like hoping uh I got the chemo, then I uh transferred my uh hospital from main, main, I mean Tokyo downtown hospital to uh near my living place. And that's also Dr. Hokman introduced me the new doctor in our hospital, yeah. Okay, and then now he's seeing me and he is a very, very nice doctor, too.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and then uh listen to you.
SPEAKER_00:Right. Then you know I learned a lot of things because uh December 28th, I had a cancer found out sentence from the doctor.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:I got a cancer, right?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Then uh I started a very, very, very strict material restricted diet.
SPEAKER_03:Uh huh.
SPEAKER_00:I don't eat anything, you know, other than cabbages, yeah, yeah, yeah. Or Chinese cabbages, you know, something like that. Almost like a two. Then unfortunately, my chemo only started, uh, was able to start March 27th.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:That means January, February, almost like a March. I have no nothing. I was so scared because my cancer is spreading. And it starts moving fast and then starts to grow. It's crazy. So I have to depend on the methane. Right. Oh, and right away, you know, like January, uh, I I I get the methanease from the Dr. Hogman and a very strict metalinum restricted diet. Right. Then finally, my uh chemo starts March 27th, and I have a picture, and then uh I share to everybody. Okay. And then there was a huge like uh meatball, you know, like a well and deep, and it comes into my uh neck, you know, ring float, something like that. Then after the uh March 27 started, like a Dr. Ruby scene, Adrian scene, three months, and then a doctor said, Okay, let's take a look at the how your cancer and a drug, I mean chemo is working. And then he took uh uh CT.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_00:90, I should say 95% gone.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Unbelievable.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, unbelievable.
SPEAKER_00:Just like mine, yeah. You know, gone. Yeah, only three months. Right. Chemo, and I read, I have a uh benefit of the I can access to uh lots of uh Dr. Hoffmann's paper.
SPEAKER_01:Right, right. Cancer and you're doing your research and learning.
SPEAKER_00:And then uh one of his students uh had a uh I mean paper regarding to a doxer rubicine and a methylase. Okay, and then they have a graph, uh like a graph and showing it if only doxorubicine this much of the maybe I should say 20 percent reduction of a cancer to more drinkage, but uh uh doxerubicine and a methane together, yeah, five times uh I mean synergy effect.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Oh this is a uh kind of science, yeah. You know, oh my god, I was so lucky I didn't know the mechanism of the how it works, right? But people don't know it, you know, and then people I I had so many Japanese cancer patients because I'm kind of facilitating the salonies, right? Right, right. And many uh Japanese cancer patients who come to us and I try to explain to a Metonian restricted diet what yeah, I can't I can't eat the protein, right? Then everybody said every everybody said, Yeah, because they thought I know they thought they need to eat protein. That's why everybody makes your system makes your body happy, right? Yeah, I I have to get the uh energy, my body gets stronger. Yeah, that means I have to eat the protein. That's why uh I mean, uh one of a lawyer who has uh colon cancer spread it to the lung, you know, keeping eating and chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, chicken, everything.
SPEAKER_03:Exactly.
SPEAKER_00:Then all of a sudden, a couple months, all the uh cancer got the power or the energy power, right? It spread. Then it's really spreading it. Right, those people come coming to us, then uh already almost too late at that point.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, you know, you're right on the edge of just like me. I was right on the edge of almost too late.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, too late because the chemo itself couldn't really know more good effect in that kind of stage of the case. So that's that's why uh just a little bit, you know. I bring back my story to uh uh three months later, uh Dr. Rubicine, uh chemo almost like uh my cancer goes almost like a 95%. It's gone, I can't see it anymore.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_00:In a little bit I can see it. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Kind of like me. I got a little bit left over.
SPEAKER_00:Then another three months because Jap Japan uh cancer chemotherapy is six months.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:Three months, Dr. Rubisine Adrian, and uh Dosetaxa. Uh-huh. Three uh then six months, and uh uh I have to uh I have to uh talk to the senior breast surgeon, and then uh I got the PET scam, like FDG PET scan. And still the senior breast surgeon want to operate the cars, that's surgery.
SPEAKER_01:They still want to do it. That's like with me, the radiation. They want to get on the calories. I'm like, what the heck?
SPEAKER_02:What's wrong with that? They want to do right. Understandable.
SPEAKER_00:You know, doctor, the first things what but uh I didn't really say to him, but uh wow, that's oh, your case. Uh chemo works so well. You your cancer not really responding to the chemo, uh chemo, but uh your case was very unusual, right?
SPEAKER_03:He says, uh huh.
SPEAKER_00:They also have to be true. Then I didn't say anything because you know I don't want to dispute him or whatever. I have extra, you know, right uh things I care. They don't hear anything. So uh especially uh my ILC in basically lobla carcinoma is a very, very bad uh response to a chemo. Only uh less than 10 people out of 100.
SPEAKER_03:Wow.
SPEAKER_00:So he was really amazed. Then I said, uh uh, I don't want to open up the uh uh my body to do it because I already had a mastectomy, so I already had a big you know surgery. Yeah, yeah. So uh I told uh a doctor, Dr. Hobo, what should I do? I don't want to do the surgery, but no, no cancer was detected in a pack, but still my surgeon wanted to do it. Then I he said he he gave me a very good uh uh warning. Yeah, okay. Tell him I would like to post a poem.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, that's what I did. I said the same thing, I got a spawn. Let's just watch it for a while.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's a good word.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that's just we're observing right now. Right.
SPEAKER_00:And then young doctor, also one another young doctor, that's my real doctor, says, you know, even you have a surgery, cancer comes back.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_00:So that's that means if I can monitor very closely, yeah uh uh in detail, probably I can I don't need to do a surgery. Uh surgery couldn't do the couldn't 100%, you know, because of I know the cancer uh uh little little little little micro cancer. It comes back.
SPEAKER_01:Cancer in you anyways, right?
SPEAKER_00:So I decided, you know, to tell I postopone. Then I didn't uh I was avoiding doing uh my surgery.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_00:Then I spoke to my doctor, how my how are you gonna do my surgery? So okay, I have to capture like a 30 or 30 or 40 minutes, you know, like uh under the arm and the left side and open up everything like a fish. Oh then take the all the tissue out.
SPEAKER_01:Oh no, no, no, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_00:I was able to avoid surgery.
SPEAKER_01:Wow.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's amazing. That's why if we know the mechanism of the cancer, right, and then how uh chemo and uh metoning restricted diet and the methanease works, right? So I was the one I really Dr. Hoffman saved me. Yeah, otherwise, I LC, if I stay on only chemo, right?
SPEAKER_01:You wouldn't have solved it the same way.
SPEAKER_00:And then my uh cancer has uh easy to uh go to the brain, lung, yeah, and lymph nodes.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, mine too. It wants to do the same things, yeah. It's easier, and it starts right here. It's like it's got an easy, yeah, right, easy way to go to all those places. It's like right there.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So um let that happen.
SPEAKER_00:Right. That's why I thought I have to uh poke, I have to share how the cancer works and how we can prevent or we can shrink treatment.
SPEAKER_02:So why why don't you tell what happened then after your chemo?
SPEAKER_00:After chemo?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. You went on your maintenance chemo.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Then after that, uh this is critical, in my opinion. Yes, I think so. Uh after that dollars to uh uh my chemo was 2022. Okay. And today it was 2025, right? Almost three years. Yeah. And I had a uh I mean uh FDG pest every six months or every eight months, you know. Then so far nothing was uh detected in that machine.
SPEAKER_04:Right.
SPEAKER_00:And then my doctor says, I am going to give you uh the uh uh uh uh molecular inhibitor.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:Uh that's uh uh kind of a uh new drug, but uh it I can get it. So I'm called targeted therapy.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01:Kind of like an immunotherapy sort of thing.
SPEAKER_00:No, it's a hormone inhibitory targeting some targeting of some kind of enzymes, maybe important. Okay, whatever, you know, cancer cancer, cancer need of this anything.
SPEAKER_02:It's not an okay, got it. Okay.
SPEAKER_00:And then I've been take taking a since uh chemo. Since chemo, I'm taking uh the maintenance chemo that's uh already taking uh just a pill, not having to get an infusion.
SPEAKER_02:You're gonna at some point gonna discuss with doctors. Oh absolutely.
SPEAKER_00:That's kind of that's inhibiting uh blocking uh cycle uh S1 and G, whatever, you know.
SPEAKER_03:We hope.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that that's the medication.
SPEAKER_01:It it's kind of uh I mean it's still on your infusion cycle. You're still on your diet, and you're still on the methionase. So essentially what's happening in chemo. Right. So what happens is you got these tumor cells or these the potential for them, your genetic code is already they're there. Yeah, you've got these cells that are like if the environment is right, they start growing. Right. But what we do is we come in and we say, Okay, well, I see your weakness. You would need these pathways open, you need these hormones to activate the hormone, you need this block within restriction, take a molecular some sort of maintenance chemo that can be almost any kind. And that's an octa oxidative stress that says if they even get started at all, it knocks them back down. So all of those things together create this place where they really, unless you mess up or it drastically mutates and changes the way it operates, which it doesn't really have the ability to do because it's not strong anymore.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_01:Well, you know, I mean anything could happen, but I mean that's right, Joe.
SPEAKER_00:I really think if you eat the methionine like a protein a lot, you know, cancer will come back very easily.
SPEAKER_01:And it wants to, yeah, very easy because looking for that.
SPEAKER_00:That's a environment, right? But the cancer environment is very uh like like it to the cancer, right? Grow and copy the DNA, spread, you know, and and it learns fast.
SPEAKER_01:So the second, if it comes back, it's gonna be ten times harder to beat than it was that first time. Well, it there's a good chance of that, and and and so every grain face it more that's the hardest thing for the patients, I think, because that's where they recall when you go through when you got a giant lump sticking on your neck, you got your attention, like you'll do whatever it takes, but then all of a sudden you start feeling good, and your skin comes back clean, and you're like, Well, you know, you know, I feel good, and we'll just you know, it's really easy to forget, and I think that that's a big part of our message is you know, um, once somebody has cancer, you're changed for life, and you can't pretend you're not, changed for life, yeah, and and so you're that's hard to for some people to it's difficult, and and it's almost impossible for some people because it's true, it requires a um a dedication, it requires uh a willpower, it requires you know to live. A will to live, exactly. A spirit, yes.
SPEAKER_02:Um, and a lot of people they don't have it.
SPEAKER_01:They yeah, I think they they uh neglect it or they uh take it for granted.
SPEAKER_02:Or they just don't have it.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So to to beat cancer, right? The most important thing is your spirit. 100%. I I believe that's really the thing that this group really has in common, the core group that shows up every week. Look at look at Gene. Yeah, amazing. I mean, he's on it 20 hours a day. Exactly. And I don't agree with him about everything he says at all, I know, but it doesn't matter. I go, the guy is alive 16 years later, and he's 82 years old. No, he's gonna be 85 at 15 years old. 85 years old, and frankly, he's lived longer with 16 years of cancer than most people I know that never got cancer.
SPEAKER_02:So he at this age, the projected lifespan is less than 16. Exactly.
SPEAKER_01:So, you know, I I I I listen to him and I see his spirit now. That's the thing that to me Scott has we are that in contact in coming, oh, absolutely. Scott's a lot younger, and he's got you know, he's closer to my age, I think, and younger than me.
SPEAKER_02:A couple years older than you.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, older than me. Okay, well, regardless, we're I know we're more walking in the same bracket. So he's got that same sort of long-term outlook, the spirit. But he's there, you know, he thinks it through, he listens, he's he's right, he got and he does it. And he does take the action. He got himself to Japan, he got that Met Pitt. He went and, you know, when a doctor doesn't tell you what you need to hear, you go and now now another opinion, and another one, and another one. We gotta get him on maintenance.
SPEAKER_02:Yes. And so he's and he's working on that target for Dr. Song. Good, good. I'm I'm I'm worried about him.
SPEAKER_01:Well, we gotta, like you said, we gotta come up with that end game, you know. You come up with the immediate need, and then you come up with the the finish of it, and then once you're finished, you start all over again, yeah, and you gotta go, how do we keep it finished?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I like to say, I think uh, you know, you want a paradigm or a model. I think Chihiro is a great paradigm. Um, she got primary cancer, breast cancer, did the standard therapy, got a mastectomy, cancer, and she thought she's through with it, as most people think.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And it recurred as it generally does a very severe lymph node metastasis, and she went on methionine-free diet, lomothionine diet, methionase, and chemo.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And three months of one course of chemo, three months of another course of chemo, and then went on maintenance chemo, staying on the lomothionine diet, staying on the methionase, and committed to doing this thing for life. Right. So if all the patients could do follow this paradigm, this model, it would be great.
SPEAKER_01:I would love to see the contrast between that group against all the others.
SPEAKER_02:In this paradigm, oh, yeah, in this paradigm. In this paradigm.
SPEAKER_00:Usually I think uh this way. Uh you are you wanted to eat a beef or chick, you know, chicken, whatever. You are you are attempt like a tendency, I mean attempting, you know, like uh uh want to eat, but uh I'm always thinking I don't want to do again the chemo.
SPEAKER_03:Right. I get it, I get it. I'm right there going.
SPEAKER_02:The chemo is so toxic, but much more toxic is is the cancer. Exactly. It's much more toxic than the chemo. That's right.
SPEAKER_01:That but the diet is the one thing that is unpleasant, but it's not toxic.
SPEAKER_02:Right. And the diet actually is not so bad. It's not so bad. There's so many delicious things. Yeah, you can put it out in the diet. Right.
SPEAKER_01:You can you can keep it good, like you just get creative, you learn how to how to how to do it right. And you know, when you do decide to have the little beans, you take double your methioninase, yeah, and and and you overcome it, and you don't do it every day, and you don't do it even, you know. Some of these guys take off two days a week. I don't take off any days a week. No, no, no, and if I have a week, if I eat some beans or if I eat an egg, I would not always double that methioninase up, and then for many days later, I do nothing. Like, I like if I if I feel like I need to get a little extra nutrition and I need to get a little extra something, and I will, I'll break and have an egg once in a great while, and then for the next two weeks, I don't, I am like religious, and I double the methanease. No problem. That's it, but that's as far as I go off the chart, you know, and that's just normal common sense. Yeah, but but when you got people that are like, Well, we do it for some days and then other days we just eat normal. I'm like, well, that's like spinning that revolver and going, Well, most days it doesn't go off, but every once in a while once in a while it does. So, yeah, go ahead, go ahead. So, so Robert, you know, I think you're you're spot on. I think that um I would love to start. I know you're collecting data, you're writing reports and and publishing these things. I can't wait to see my case study come out. It'll come out in a couple weeks. I'm looking forward to it so very much.
SPEAKER_02:Right around the first.
SPEAKER_01:I love it. And then I've got a number of doctors that I can't wait to see. That's right. That's right. You talk.
SPEAKER_03:Thank you, thank you.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you. Live action here at the Anti Cancer Institute. You bet. Love it.
SPEAKER_02:Who's that for this one?
SPEAKER_00:This is uh thermal feature.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you very much. That's fantastic. Thank you, sir.
SPEAKER_01:So Robert, why don't you share with our listeners kind of Shahiro's role? She came out here for a week with what is it that we're doing here?
SPEAKER_02:Okay, so we have a branch in Japan. Branch in this company. It's called Anti-Cancer Japan. Right. And Chihiro runs it. Oh, right. Good job. And and I'll tell you right now, we have more methionase patients from Japan than we do from America. Wow. And Chihiro is working very closely with the group that has the MedPet. Oh, beautiful.
SPEAKER_01:So what a beauty that you got the people participating more have access to this advanced scanning that we don't even look here.
SPEAKER_02:This is so critical that the doctor there, Dr. Sato, he tells his patients, go on methionics. We don't have such a doctor here. Dr. Castro tells some of the patients. Well, he at least is accepting of it.
SPEAKER_01:When I met him and I'm very close, very close. I told him about that. He said, okay. The other doctors are like, whatever. No, he's he very much. Even Dr.
SPEAKER_02:Song is like, okay, I don't know. It's okay. Yeah, yeah. He's a female guy. Exactly. We we get what we want from him and a million times more. Absolutely. So um, so uh Chihiro's a key person in Japan. Wonderful. And uh Japan is so accepting of uh methionine restriction being part of cancer treatment, it's spreading and spreading. That's by Dr. Sadio. And also another doctor uh called uh uh what's his name? Uh I forgot his name. The peritoneal surgeon. Oh Yoni Mura. Yonimura. Dr. Yoni Mura, who is very different from Dr. Sado. He's a surgeon that operates on people that are sent basically sent to hospice. Got it. He saves them. Okay. They have all this taskuses in there.
SPEAKER_01:Those are the guys that are generally open to outside the box treatments.
SPEAKER_02:Right, right. He's he's an outlier like Dr. Son. Right, right. He operates on people the other surgeons won't operate on. Yeah. And and then he gets a lot of criticism. Right. But um, so some of those people now are going on methionine restriction, and some of them are doing pretty good. Well, maybe Japan is the doorway for the paradigm. Japan is in the lead now. The world lead of methionine restriction. Right. And a large part of that is due to Tihiro. Wonderful. And Dr. Sado, Dr. Yuri Mura.
SPEAKER_01:Um so you're making the methionine is here and shipping it there, or is it being made there as well?
SPEAKER_02:No, we make it here. It's not easy to make a joke. Yeah, I know.
SPEAKER_01:In fact, as far as I know, you guys are the ones that make it, right?
SPEAKER_02:And if and Chihiro helps with the shipment, she's always on the phone to fit. But that's instrumental. It gets there within 24 hours.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, beautiful.
SPEAKER_00:What I say 36 hours.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, yeah. But still, I mean, that's a long flight. And uh, you know, you're able to keep it protected for that moment of time, and that's that's amazing. It doesn't need much protection, but there we are.
SPEAKER_00:I I yeah, right.
SPEAKER_01:Couldn't be more impressed. Well, we're we're blasted through time. I, you know, I try to keep these kind of to a half hour or so. We're probably a little over that. But Shakira, do you have any uh specific message for our listeners? Such a special energy.
SPEAKER_00:Actually, I have been uh taking care or supporting a cancer patient who has no more treatment. Then uh doctor already uh said no more, you know, and then they don't know what to do, right? Because if they they have been doing a chemo, but the chemo uh uh cannot really uh can only take so much sometimes, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Well, and but some you can probably take a lot more than these doctors are willing to give. Probably song, yeah, giving you now four more cycles. Yeah, where the doctors at at Irvine said you've got three maxed out at three, and now you're uh you've already gone through.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, so and he was talking about the possibility, if needed, of going further. So, you know, that's it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, as long as he doesn't care about what's in the guidelines, he cares about you. Right. Get rid of this cancer, do what it takes. Exactly.
SPEAKER_00:So, I mean, I I tried to like to uh send like uh chemo uh and then methionine restriction, yes, and methionine uh methanase, or or the degrading of methionine. All three parts are critical. That's all three parts had so much synergy effect that nobody knows about that's why uh so many people are looking for the second opinion because they have no way.
SPEAKER_02:Right.
SPEAKER_00:They are that's why they go to Dr.
SPEAKER_02:Sato, then they go to Sato Castro.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. Then Dr. Sato said, okay, you take this methanase.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and then he does a lot of other things chemoimmunotherapy and special radiation, not the not the stuff that burns you to death. Right, right, right. There's all kinds of ways to do this. Absolutely, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:So that's what we we don't need to give up.
SPEAKER_02:Right. We have a way never give up. Well, there's some what that there was one patient that that the wife called me. They talked about it a little bit on the on the Zoom last time. He he's he got lung cancer all over his body, brain. Yeah. He said, Should I give him ivermectin? And I said, I don't think it'll help.
SPEAKER_01:No. Yeah, ivermectin is is kind of an adjunct that goes it is and nothing would help.
SPEAKER_02:Right.
SPEAKER_01:The patient is gonna he's when it gets over the line over a certain thing, it's a point where it's eating you faster than you can give it anything. And it's gotta get can't let it get there. No, exactly. That's the key. We can't let it get there, and it you see it coming, you know. It generally look at that poor guy, uh uh Peter.
SPEAKER_02:Right? Oh, he's got I know, I know, I don't know. I don't know. The opiates, I know opioids, whatever. Fortunately, I think he may have can you try the Lupron? No, yeah, okay, okay.
SPEAKER_01:No spirit. Yeah, well, I think he's thinking about it, and I think I he talks to me, and I'm I'm kind of trying to encourage that fire. He sees me going through with my chemo, and I'm still helping him. Yeah, and and I tell him, I go, I'm I'm having a rough day, but look, I'm still talking to you. So, you know, exactly, Joe. Consider what I'm saying, you know. And so I'm doing everything in my power to, you know, to keep him. Yeah, you know, but the problem is a lot of us we come to this point, we say, Well, I'm gonna try. He was down in Mexico getting some herbal treatment, and it's not that those things can't be helpful, they just don't work most of the time. You're not gonna make a dream. Well, the thing is, is what happens is the one guy out of 40 or one guy out of 400 that gets a result from something like that is they're not talking. They might have been spontaneous, might not be.
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. We don't know most of it. We don't know most of the answer. That's not what we base our our our our strategy on. It's not the one out of 400, it's a lot of things.
SPEAKER_01:But the other one is that these guys hear because they they're saying the thing they want to hear that says when you can eat a piece of fruit and you will cancer will go away. And it's like, okay, well, maybe you ate a piece of fruit and your cancer went away, but the two don't necessarily one didn't cause the other. But I don't believe they went away. Well, and there you go. And I and then for whatever thing, we just don't know. And what we're doing here, we're documenting, we're testing, we're we're we're we're following protocols that that we keep watching work, we're sharing our information of these things that work, and we're we're we're we're building the the the body of work that says, well, now there's 400 people that we've have similar results doing a similar thing. And they all were in a situation where they were, if the trajectory hadn't changed, it'd all be gone by now. Yeah. And I think that's imperative for us to look at like what happens if we didn't do what we did. We already know that curve. Well, we can't prove it, but we can sure know it. We watch it happen over and over again. So, well, guys, I I just am so grateful to be part of this community. And I'm glad to be able to contribute to it. Um Shahiro. So grateful to you. Thank you for all your photos up there. Exactly, exactly. And my lovely wife over here, who you can't see, she's standing behind me helping everything we do, and and she gives me a lot of strength. So all right. Well, this has been another episode of the Healthy Living Podcast. I'm your host, Joe Grumbine, and we will see you next time.
SPEAKER_03:Great.
SPEAKER_01:This was a
